E85Forum.com

antoans4 · Joined: 19 Oct 2009 Posts: 5

Hi guys im new here in the forum,i heard than in the winter they sell E70 and E60 instead of E85, Why is that? would that be also here in florida?

skiracer · Posted: Tue Oct 20, 2009 9:28 am Post subject:

They sell lower ethanol blends in the winter since cold starting and engine in colder climates is more difficult with higher blends of ethanol.

Here's a link to a geographic distribution of ethanol blends:
http://forums.evolutionm.net/5858125-post1.html

Class 1 – Ethanol content min. 79%
Class 2 – Ethanol content min. 74%
Class 3 – Ethanol content min. 70%

Class 1 – Gasoline content min. 17%
Class 2 – Gasoline content min. 17%
Class 3 – Gasoline content min. 17%

Combining the above minimums creates the following range for ethanol content:

Class 1 – Ethanol content min. 79% - max. 83%
Class 2 – Ethanol content min. 74% - max. 83%
Class 3 – Ethanol content min. 70% - max. 83%
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'06 Evo IX Stage 1 by RRE,Walbro 255lph fuel pump,RC Engineering1000cc Injectors, AVO exhaust,RRE flash, (325whp @ 22PSI 91 octane, 353whp @ 25psi on 100 octane, 383whp @30psi on E85),Zeitronix wideband/Ethanol Content Analyzer, Defi gauges

Alcohol · Joined: 17 Apr 2007 Posts: 634 Location: Central Wisconsin

As you can see- Florida never has to go below 74% ethanol content and the reality is that 78.4% is most likely the minimum ethanol content used in the winter due to the fact that ethanol is now E98 (with 2% gas) vs the former 95%. The 17% minimum gas content is confusing so one should focus on the ethanol content line. Summer max would be 83.3% pure alcohol.

As was correctly stated- the purpose of adding gas was to ease cool morning starts since the RVP of ethanol is only 2.3 #. The addition of gas keeps the RVP up around the 8 # level. RVP= lbs vapor pressure at 100 degrees F and is an indicator of fuel volatility/ startability. While this is great for EFI cars it is something that carb'ed engines have to be adjusted for to maintain proper air/fuel ratios.

antoans4 · Joined: 19 Oct 2009 Posts: 5

Thank u guys, so i dont have to worry about

skiracer · Posted: Tue Oct 20, 2009 10:46 pm Post subject:

You should still test the ethanol content on occasion. I.E., in Northern California, one of the pumps out there had E50, 50% ethanol which was tested by the State. Not good to run E50 when you're tuned on E85...
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'06 Evo IX Stage 1 by RRE,Walbro 255lph fuel pump,RC Engineering1000cc Injectors, AVO exhaust,RRE flash, (325whp @ 22PSI 91 octane, 353whp @ 25psi on 100 octane, 383whp @30psi on E85),Zeitronix wideband/Ethanol Content Analyzer, Defi gauges

antoans4 · Joined: 19 Oct 2009 Posts: 5

i guess im gonna have to buy the Zeitronix E85 think or there is a cheaper one

Alcohol · Joined: 17 Apr 2007 Posts: 634 Location: Central Wisconsin

antoans4 · Joined: 19 Oct 2009 Posts: 5

There is a lot cheaper way if you do not mind the hassle of testing- the two links below show 1st; the water test method of determining ethanol content and 2nd; a thread with a test kit, price ($14.99), and sources. There is also a Kent Moore tester- more money and not mounted- a off the car tester.

http://iqlearningsystems.com/ethanol/downloads/E85test.pdf

http://www.e85performance.net/forums/showthread.php?p=3142#post3142

If you can read the long term fuel trims in your ECU- then you can easily estimate what % alcohol you are running if it is a closed loop system similar to factory.

You do not really tell us what you are running- if it is an FFV - forget everything we just told you and fill it up and forget it. If it is carb'ed then you better tell us because the situation is different.[/quote]

I drive a 2001 Audi S4 is fuel injection

Alcohol · Joined: 17 Apr 2007 Posts: 634 Location: Central Wisconsin

I am not familiar with Audi's ECU programming but assume that you have either 1) gone to a larger injector, 2) modified your fuel maps, 3) increased fuel pressure, 4) or are using some piggy-back device and are running at stoich on summer blend E85 with normal long term fuel trims. As long as you are still using the O2 sensor in closed loop the ECU should cut the fuel down to compensate for the fall (75%) blend. You might remain a bit rich in open loop if there is no learn function in it.

Let's leave this up for discussion for those more experienced in this than I Smile

skiracer · Posted: Thu Oct 22, 2009 1:25 pm Post subject:

If you're not tuned at the absolute limit, if you find your gas going from E85 to E70, normally you don't need to touch your tune. Just lower your boost down a tad and it should be fine for street driving. If you're road racing or drag racing, you might want to adjust your tune.
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'06 Evo IX Stage 1 by RRE,Walbro 255lph fuel pump,RC Engineering1000cc Injectors, AVO exhaust,RRE flash, (325whp @ 22PSI 91 octane, 353whp @ 25psi on 100 octane, 383whp @30psi on E85),Zeitronix wideband/Ethanol Content Analyzer, Defi gauges

antoans4 · Joined: 19 Oct 2009 Posts: 5

[quote="Alcohol"]I am not familiar with Audi's ECU programming but assume that you have either 1) gone to a larger injector, 2) modified your fuel maps, 3) increased fuel pressure, 4) or are using some piggy-back device and are running at stoich on summer blend E85 with normal long term fuel trims. As long as you are still using the O2 sensor in closed loop the ECU should cut the fuel down to compensate for the fall (75%) blend. You might remain a bit rich in open loop if there is no learn function in it.

Im runing 80pounds injectors, 3bar Fuel preasure regulator,Stock ECU with a flash from Vast Performance with E85 and 93 oct programs