E85Forum.com

specialgreen · Posted: Tue Dec 13, 2005 11:37 pm Post subject: the return of Captain Ethanol

I was at a Minneapolis filling station late Saturday night, and there was a siver minivan in front, plastered with signs reading "Any car can burn E-85 50/50 mix", or something like that... in foot-high letters! There were also huge E-85 logos, etc. It reminded me of the vans you see outside the football stadium on game day... except that there's no E-85 team.

Inside, there was a 50-something gentleman handing-out photocopies of his fuel receipts, espousing the benefits of E-85. I didn't mind the attention he might generate, but his enthusiasm was a bit startling.

Revision · Joined: 14 Sep 2005 Posts: 194 Location: Carol Stream, IL

We might see more of that when gas prices soar again this summer.

How about some "Powered by Corn" stickers for the group to put on their gas tank covers. Wink

chenely63 · Joined: 09 Aug 2005 Posts: 27

I use a 50/50 mix of E85 - E 10 in my ford ranger four cly 1996 and dont turn on the flex tex unit and dont get the cel light on or any thing else bad,
Leo

Corn Squeezins · Joined: 14 Dec 2005 Posts: 42 Location: Madison, WI

I have a '99 Mercury Mountaineer & a '02 Buick Rendezvous & both run
very well on a 50/50 mix of E85! I have been reading/watching this post since the Katrina disaster & have been experimenting with it ever since!
I have had experience with E10 for years and knew it wouldn't hurt
a modern fuel system - but was also not sure where the limit would be for
SES light turn on for most modern (post 1996) OBD 2 vehicles.
I would try to answer any automotive questions as best as possible if anyone needs any advice on some of the elect. functional abilities of these newer vehicles. Alot of misinformation is out there....!!

Lgodave · Joined: 01 Sep 2005 Posts: 28 Location: WI

Hi,

RE: "Any car can burn E-85 50/50 mix"

I'd probably agree with Captain Ethanol, if he was talking about an OBD II vehicle... The SES light probably wouldn't go on, and assuming the computer can adjust the air/fuel mixture enough it may go unnoticed by the average user. The Flex-tek module as I understand it doesn't do anything for E40 or less blends, so a 50/50 E85 blend isn't much different from that.

I'd still have long term concerns for the Fuel System, but since there have been several NON-FFV OBD II vehicles running lower E85 blends for the past couple years... the effects may be minor OR are going to take longer to cause a problem. I've also read that blends of Ethanol under say E50 would have the similar corrosive propers of E10 meaning vehicles that handle E10 won't see much issue with these higher blends...

Volvo-Berti · Joined: 24 Oct 2005 Posts: 16 Location: Germany

hm, do I have an OBD II vehicle?? i do not know which kind of OBD mine is.

my car is a 945 volvo Turbo with 99kW born 1995.

to the E50-blend: my car runs with an E35 mix actually without any problems, consuming about 10% more. but that can be caused by the colder weather we have now since i have begun testing and driving with ethanol.
_________________
greets
Berti

Corn Squeezins · Joined: 14 Dec 2005 Posts: 42 Location: Madison, WI

If I were to guess your vehicle is OBD I compliant. Here in the US all
cars made after 1996 are mandatory OBD II diagnostic emissions compliant. What does that mean to you... only that OBD II is more
sensitive to turning on the "check engine or service engine soon"
light in the event that the computer senses that the emissions level
is exceeding 1.5 times what it was certified for when it left the factory.
OBD II also has a standardized connector for code retrieval/diagnostics and commonality in basic code definitions unlike older systems. In the US this means it can
be worked on in a greater array of service shops and not just at the dealership alone.
It also means that the older systems are not as sensitive to these changes (diagnostic wise) and will allow for more wiggle room before turning on the emissions lights. In general older systems diagnostics are just more coarse & require more basics testing when servicing.
The myth many people nowdays think is that "plugging in some machine
to my car will just tell me what is wrong..." when in reality it still takes an educated person to fix "what it sees as wrong " when it spits out codes and not just assume that it can see worn spark plugs, fuel pump pressure... etc. This make any sense to you?!?!? Hope it isn't confusing.

chenely63 · Joined: 09 Aug 2005 Posts: 27

corn squeezins,,,, what can you tell me about the flex fuel sensor chev uses in their S 10 pickups? could it be used in fuel line and read out with a meter?
Leo

Volvo-Berti · Joined: 24 Oct 2005 Posts: 16 Location: Germany

Corn Squeezins · Joined: 14 Dec 2005 Posts: 42 Location: Madison, WI

Here is the best info that I have found on the flex fuel S10 sensor
system... info is on page 3 of link...

http://www.gmtechlink.com/images/issues/arcv_pdf/3_00_e.pdf

hope this link works ok for you...
explains its function fairly well on this page...
Ford has used something quite similar - if not identical - on their
Ranger flex fuel models.

PumpingE85 · Joined: 19 Jun 2005 Posts: 25

It is my understanding that both Ford and GM have dropped the flex fuel sensor module. In the last two model years, everything has been done using the O2 sensors and computer controls.

Corn Squeezins · Joined: 14 Dec 2005 Posts: 42 Location: Madison, WI

That's what I have heard also. Another one that I don't know about
is the Nissan Titan pickups... not sure how their system is set up but
would expect the same reliance on o2 sensors also. Anyone else out
there know about them....

chenely63 · Joined: 09 Aug 2005 Posts: 27

the flex fuel sensor used on the S 10, can it be read out with a DVM with a frequency range?
Leo

Corn Squeezins · Joined: 14 Dec 2005 Posts: 42 Location: Madison, WI

Yes I would think u could technically hook up a sensor such as this...
but... what u would need is a control unit that could intervene with the
fuel system or a special pcm to actually utilize the data in any productive way other than a high tech alcohol sensor for manual output of a freq.
denoting alcohol percentage. In other words, what good is it on our cars
if we have no way of using it for the computer? I think u would need
a custom pcm or something as this would be hard to just "add" to a normal car pcm in any realistic way. Also it would require cobbling it into
a line somewhere and installing safe connection with different line materials, steel, nylon, rubber hoses, etc. Not exactly going to gain us much in the real world is what I see for this sensor use on other cars not designed for it. Maybe a special flex tek unit could be used but other than
that I don't see any point, do you?

chenely63 · Joined: 09 Aug 2005 Posts: 27

I have a flex tek unit, the reason I would use thr flex fuel sensor is I just would like to know the percent ethanol I am burning so can see how the percent of enthanol and gas mileage go. just for the info.
I also have the best actron scanner, think it is about as cheap you will get for what it does.
Leo